Difference between Whonix and kickSecure on Qubes?

[oinkthepig]

I am on a qubes/whonix installation. I’ve been trying to install some apps in a whonix template, but the Whonix documented instructions told me to install these specific apps on a Kicksecure AppTemplate/AppVM instead of just adding repositories to Whonex for Qubes. I did so and morphed my Debian 12 Qubes installation into a Kicksecure Template, and then followed the instructions on the Whonix documentation site to install my desired apps.

What is the difference between Kicksecure on Qubes and Whonix on Qubes? What is more secure? What would have been the difference if I just installed the desired repositories on Whonix for qubes, instead of on Kicksecure templates? How necessary is it to use Kicksecure when whonix instructs you to do so with certain apps like Session Messenger and SimpleX Messenger?

I am also confused about weather or not Kicksecure routes all traffic through tor like whonix? If it does, what is the point of having both kicksecure AND whonix in development? Why not just develop one or the other? What are the security advantages of on over the other?

[FranklyFlawless]

Differences between Kicksecure and Whonix in Qubes OS

Kicksecure is security-focused operating system. Whonix is an anonymous operating system and based on, hardened by Kicksecure. In result, Whonix and Kicksecure have the same security features. Any existing or upcoming security related features are always implemented in Kicksecure and then Whonix will benefit from these too. That seems messy. I wouldn’t want to develop an implementation where users have to resort to such hacks. Whonix for anonymity. Kicksecure for security-only.

[extraextra]

@oinkthepig

but the Whonix documented instructions told me to install these specific apps on a Kicksecure AppTemplate/AppVM instead

They didn’t. Read that again. You’re reading something into it which doesn’t exist.

Whonix is based on Kicksecure. Based on.

They don’t tell you “stop using Whonix and use Kicksecure instead”.

Which means you can often use the exactly same documentation.

And they’re both based on Debian. So that mostly works too. And even instructions for other Linux distributions often work with distribution specific adjustments.

@oinkthepig

What is the difference between Kicksecure on Qubes and Whonix on Qubes?

I suggest to visit the homepage of each project and read it. Then most of your questions should be answered.

[extraextra]

Kicksecure and Whonix serve different purposes. Kicksecure is focused on security hardening while Whonix is designed specifically for anonymity

Key Differences

Security vs Anonymity

• Kicksecure provides security hardening features without anonymity
• Whonix forces all traffic through Tor and provides anonymity features

Network Routing

• Kicksecure does not route traffic through Tor by default
• Whonix uses a two-VM model with Gateway and Workstation to force Tor routing

Usage Guidelines

When to Use Kicksecure

• For applications that need security but don’t require anonymity

When to Use Whonix

• For activities requiring anonymity
• When you need guaranteed Tor routing
• For applications that could leak identifying information

[Patrick]

Template:Upstream wiki - Whonix seems to be causing confusion. The wiki will be edited to clarify this.

[Patrick]

That wiki template has been improved.

A new wiki page has been created:

Comparison - Whonix versus Kicksecure

Does that clarify things?

[FranklyFlawless]

It is a good start, but only the Whonix template is available from the Qubes OS community repository, whereas Kicksecure does not have a maintained community template and requires distro-morphing using a Debian template instead.

[extraextra]

How’s Kicksecure Qubes Template availability related to the user who simply should have kept using Whonix and doesn’t need to install Kicksecure?

[FranklyFlawless]

The topic question is the difference between Whonix and Kicksecure on Qubes, so my posts are focused on answering it. So far, I have provided a quote from @Patrick highlighting the differences between Whonix and Kicksecure without any mention of Qubes OS (other than that similar topic title and post being in the Qubes-Whonix category), whereas my latter/latest post (ignoring this one) has an explicit reference to Qubes OS and thus actual relevance towards this topic question, along with addressing the other topic as well.