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How does VPN running outside VM affect whonix??

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#1

Hello,

I have read the topics on whonix and VPNs my computer knowledge is very limited so if you could answer my question like you would to a small child I would be very thankful. I am running whonix on virtualbox on Ubuntu I know Qubes is the best for Whonix but I am working on getting that set up. Currently I am running a VPN which I have tested has no DNS leaks on Ubuntu, then I am running Whonix on Virtualbox my question is this:

Can my ISP see that I am using tor through the set up that I currently have?? From what I have read the optimal set up is to have the VPN run through the VM and then run whonix, I have yet to figure that out. From my limited perspective it seems like running a VPN outside the VM would force your ISP to see that you are on an encrypted open VPN and can therefore not see that I am accessing tor via whonix?? Please do not refer me to the whonix topics on VPNs as I have read it multiple times and still can’t tell if I am safe from snooping ISPs.

#2

Please read this;

#3

Dear Sir,

I have read the link you sent multiple times, from reading it multiple times I gather that basically you can hide tor usage from your ISP by using a VPN or obsfugated tor bridges. I have read other articles that recommend doing both, and still further I have read articles that say the best set up is using 2 VPNs one on the host and then one on the workstation so it is VPN > VM> Whonix > VPN > Tor. Again forgive my lack of knowledge and understanding. It seems if we look at whonix usage from a time line perspective in the early days it was something that only people wanting the highest privacy wanted people who were hosting on tor etc. Now in these days where the TBB is just not enough there are more people using whonix just for another line of safety for their tor usage. So is it safe to assume that the set up that I described above DOES hide my whonix and tor usage from ISP in that all they see is that I am using a VPN?? Where fingerprinting is the one way they could see that I am using tor?? Again I apologize for being new to this and not nearly as computer savy as most of you.

Thanks in advance.

#4

Good day,

Yes. That would also be precisley what the link @Patrick gave you says.

Have a nice day,

Ego

1 Like
#5

It’s best you can get, however no solution can provide strong guarantees. Relevant quote:

Using a VPN or SSH does not provide strong guarantees of hiding the fact you are using Tor from your ISP either.

And the text above it applies as well.

#6

Forgive my stupidity but if all they see is an encrypted open VPN how can they know I am using tor??

#7

Good day,

That would tie into the whole discussion about VPN Providers and how willing they’d actually be to protect you. The emphasis here lies on “guarantees”.

Have a nice day,

Ego

1 Like
#8

That, and VPN/SSH Fingerprinting.

https://trac.torproject.org/projects/tor/wiki/doc/TorPlusVPN#VPNSSHFingerprinting

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